Sudbury Local News - Steelworkers give 'misleading story' about Brazilian meeting, says Vale

A spokesperson for Vale Inco and Steelworkers officials appear to have a difference of opinion about a meeting that happened between the union officials and a Brazilian senator Dec. 10.

A delegation of United Steelworkers leaders from Canada say officials from Vale, the parent company of Vale Inco, failed to show up at a Dec. 10 senate hearing in Brazil, where the union leaders were due to speak.

The union leaders say the hearing was set up for the Brazilian senate to hear about ongoing labour disputes between Vale Inco in Canada and about 3,500 Steelworkers members in Sudbury and Port Colborne, Ont. and Voisey's Bay, Nfld.

The United Steelworkers Canadian national director, Ken Neumann, is in Brazil this week, accompanied by Steelworkers Local 6500 vice-president Rick Bertrand, and Steelworkers Local 9508 president Darren Cove (who represents 120 striking workers in Voisey's Bay).

All three union leaders spoke to the media from Brazil during a teleconference this morning.

Vale Inco spokesperson Steve Ball said he listened to a recording of the teleconference, and said a lot of the Steelworkers' statements were “misleading.”

Ball said that the meeting was a private one between the Steelworkers and a single Brazilian senator, and there was “no contact” with Vale to show up to “any meetings” in the country.

“This was a completely misleading story that was given. We were not asked to be there.”

Northern Life has contacted the Steelworkers to ask whether Ball's statements are true.

Brazilian Senator Paulo Paim, who set up the hearing, was persuaded by Vale to change it from a public hearing to a private hearing, said Neumann said, during the teleconference.

“The Steelworkers had agreed to that change of venue because we looked at the importance of trying to set the stage to get back to the bargaining table,” Neumann said.

“We were also informed that they would have high-ranking officials that would be at this private hearing, to be held today.”

Vale has “shown its arrogance” by not showing up at the private hearings, said Neumann.

At one point during the hearings, the Brazilian senator running the session received a phone call from a Vale official, who asked if the hearings were still going ahead, despite their absence, said Neumann.

The hearings were video-taped, and will be shown to Vale officials. Vale officials were not compelled by Brazilian law to show up at the hearings, said Neumann.

Neumann said that during the hearings, the Steelworkers urged Vale to get back to the bargaining table without demanding contract concessions as a precondition.

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41 Comments

2010 12/16/2009 12:52:07 AM - Report Abuse

you shouldn't say buh bye la! it gives away your identity
drifter 12/15/2009 5:30:17 PM - Report Abuse

Well paisan......watching the UFC is often like watching the local strike.......There's these Brazilian guys who regularly outsmart and kick the shit out of the American guys.

Its not as exciting as playing cards but there's an interesting cross section of people who watch it. I'm proud to say I'm a fan......even with out the Brazilian vs American aspect...of the UFC.

I don't understand how a former Provincial Champ boxer like you can not be interested in it.......after all, professional boxing has been totally destroyed by Don King and the UFC is as honest a combat sport as you can get
drifter 12/15/2009 1:27:43 PM - Report Abuse

Obviously Eddie has raised his standards.
Mario_3 12/15/2009 11:29:58 AM - Report Abuse

Hey,30 years ago,my buddies and i were regulars at Eddie's,drinking beer and having a few 'veal on a bun'.If it wasnt for us ,keeping him in business..........YOU would be looking for a NEW barstool.......where you could share your 'wisdom' with everyone
drifter 12/15/2009 10:51:53 AM - Report Abuse

PM
Regarding nickel prices, keep in mind the Cdn $ at $0.95 US takes a big chunk out of the profitability of nickel sales mined in Canadian $ and sold in American $ compared to historical exchange rate
drifter 12/15/2009 10:45:40 AM - Report Abuse

FYI.......Why is it so hard for you to understand?

The pension plan for all existing Vale employees was unchanged. Any employees who are (were that is) going to reach retirement with less than 30 years service had an option to choose either plan.
Only FUTURE employees would be on a different pension plan. Of course if they don't like the new plan, they can go back to flipping burgers.

Here's a thought......if Vale Inco want to REALLY play hardball or the Brazilian equivalent, after Jan 14th, all employees returning to work would be considered "new" for the purposes of the pension plan. If Local 6500 have any "stroke" left they may be able to negotiate this one.

BTW......there's a certain standard to qualify for barstools at Eddies but there's lots of room at CJ's Soup Kitchen.
Mario_3 12/15/2009 8:22:04 AM - Report Abuse

Well,i guess your right,Phil Morris,.......im going to stop defending the Steelworkers for trying to keep their pensions.Ive finally seen 'the light'

From now on,im going to become a model citizen and spend all my nites on the bar stools at Cranky Joe's and Eddie's with you and your buddy 'Kissinger junior' and watch Ufc.

This way.........Sudbury will really prosper
Phillip Morris 12/15/2009 5:16:37 AM - Report Abuse

You're wrong Mr.Mario.
Inco lost 44 million in the first 1/4 of the year when nickel once hit a low of just under $5 a pound. The AVERAGE price at that time was around the six dollar mark.
Nickel currently floats in the mid seven dollar mark.
Basically a 20% increase in price.
So should Vale send the Steal-workers back to the mines and accept a loss of $30 million instead? Would they find $20 million a 1/4 acceptable?
Give the blind propaganda a rest.
Vale will not prop up the Ontario Division with its other, profitable, global operations. They've made it quite clear, and rightfully won't settle just to be even deeper in trouble in the next downturn. They owe a responsible and profitable company to its shareholders. Those 'rich' people are Mutual Fund and stock holders just like you.

The global nickel market has changed. Sudbury is NOT a leader anymore. Vale can afford to run a skeleton operation to keep the wheels greased and break even. They've even gone on record to say they're losing $7 million on projected overall profits with minor delays at the lines. Imagine the total in positive cash flow when the plants and mines crank up in January? Even better when the union bites hard on blockades and are later ordered to completely clear the entrances.

Sober up 6500. You've been mislead by Gerard, Fera, and Fraser with their personal dreams of global union building on your backs.
drifter 12/12/2009 8:54:54 PM - Report Abuse

Ninja the TURDDLE
Just a little more info...the product of the conventional (not pressure leaching) laterite mines is a ferro nickel shape or a briquet of iron, nickel and pms where available.
This briquet is much like the product of the smelter. It can be sent to a refinery for production of 99.9% electro plating nickel or shipped directly to producers of stainless steel for use.
Sudbury's control of or even influence on the nickel market is history.
Google "Goldcorp Strike" and see what can happen.
sean10 12/12/2009 6:51:51 PM - Report Abuse

Agree!!!! The world has changed . USE can not use the same way to deal with vale. Vale is not Inco!!!!!
drifter 12/12/2009 3:38:34 PM - Report Abuse

Electro nickel--99.99% is produced in Thompson, Russia and will be in Goro.
After 5 months nothing has collapsed in the US from lack of Sudbury's electro nickel.....

The days are past when Sudbury controlled 90% of nickel produced.
TITO_1 12/12/2009 12:55:39 PM - Report Abuse

Sudbury does not sell on the world maket, Sudbury sells it's nickel to the U.S. in it's purest form which makes it highly sought after. Nickel produced at lower costs is dirty metal and has to be refined a second time adding to its cost.
drifter 12/11/2009 9:05:54 PM - Report Abuse

duran
Sudbury nickel is not needed on the world nickel market. If Sudbury were to hit full production next month, the price of nickel would collapse and Vale Inco would have huge losses...Keep in mind Goro in New Caledonia is scheduled to come on line with a huge capital debt and Vale Inco has to start getting some income for this project. Also, Vale Inco have a nickel project in Brazil scheduled to come on line to further load the world nickel market.

Projected production costs for these projects are $1.00/lb. Sudbury nickel is about triple this.

Do you think Vale Inco will start up Sudbury production and not Brazil? If the world needs more nickel, the miners in Brazil will be producing it.

Anyone who thinks otherwise has been boxing without headgear.
jess_35 12/11/2009 9:02:05 PM - Report Abuse

Wouldn't it be nice if BOTH sides were completely honest? While we're at it, wouldn't it be nice if people on BOTH sides of the debate stopped with the insults. No one is "stupid" solely because they disagree with you.

I'm not anti-union. I want to see these workers off the lines and getting their paychecks. I'm anti-strike. When the only monetary loss to current employees is a potential one (nickel bonus cap), that's not too drastic of a concession. AND they do get some bonuses, but Fera doesn't want to talk about all that.

Now is not the climate to fight, but now it's too late and everyone needs to save face. Pride is a dangerous thing.

And no, I'm not jealous. I have no agenda or vendetta. I don't work minimum wage and I don't wish strikers doom. So Mario, don't generalize by saying ALL. I'm simply a person in the community stating my opinion. I know it doesn't count for anything, but that freedom of speech thing means I get to say/type my opinion.
Mario_3 12/11/2009 6:47:34 PM - Report Abuse

You make several valid points,'duran'.Actually,i mentionned many times,the ONLY time vale lost money,was the 44 million ,which i believe was the first 1/4 of the year.

Nickel prices were $4 a lbs.Prices have nearly doubled since then.They would recoup that in a heartbeat.

P.S. Dont waste your time trying to convince the naysayers.When you read between the lines,they ALL have vendetta's,agenda's or 'hate-ons' towards unions or Vale workers
duram 12/11/2009 5:08:38 PM - Report Abuse

I am a striking worker at vale and what I'm not getting is why I have heard so much about the recession being the excuse for vale not talking but I haven't heard any body remind the community that vale was not effected by that recession in fact a news paper article said that not only were they not effected but they made ten times the yearly profit each year for both the years that the recession was at it's worse. and the concessions that vale is asking for wouldn't help them during a recession because the bonuses only kick in when we make a profit, and even then, they have 101 ways to surcumvent paying that bonus.
2010 12/11/2009 3:40:13 PM - Report Abuse

Forget where I read this but as far as buying the gifts in T.O. think they get 'em at cost price and buy directly from supplier. Apparently no local establishment is willing to do that.
drifter 12/11/2009 3:03:45 PM - Report Abuse

Hey DL
I'll bet you they bought the toys at WalMart and they ere made in China. All the profits go to the US and all the work goes to China.

One more day (closer to de-certification)
D. Laframboise 12/11/2009 2:57:58 PM - Report Abuse

Mar atleast the money was spent in canada. Its not like the USW is raping the land, polluting the environment, ripping of their employees, ripping off the government, and sending the money out of the country like vale. I realize that people hate unions and will always hate unions, but I think the union is the lesser of the two evils in this labour dispute.
Top Gun 12/11/2009 2:41:31 PM - Report Abuse

Hey DL I feel sorry for the people on strike. The union is a joke, always has been, always will. A wino leader? Give me a break.
Mar_2 12/11/2009 2:25:47 PM - Report Abuse

No sympathy any more the these guys..take down your little blue signs that say "shop local". The union bought $30,000.00 worth of toys for their Christmas party in Toronto. What is up with that!!! Maybe EVERYONE should start speaking the truth..to everyone!! Can you imagine what that 30 G's worth of spending would have done for SUDBURY...not Brazil, Toronto or even Jamica should see that money. Way to go Local 6500..make Sudbury proud to stand by you!!!
Mar_2 12/11/2009 2:25:24 PM - Report Abuse

No sympathy any more the these guys..take down your little blue signs that say "shop local". The union bought $30,000.00 worth of toys for their Christmas party in Toronto. What is up with that!!! Maybe EVERYONE should start speaking the truth..to everyone!! Can you imagine what that 30 G's worth of spending would have done for SUDBURY...not Brazil, Toronto or even Jamica should see that money. Way to go Local 6500..make Sudbury proud to stand by you!!!
sandman 12/11/2009 1:11:05 PM - Report Abuse

lol... right, and Vale's information isn't "misleading"?
D. Laframboise 12/11/2009 12:26:55 PM - Report Abuse

The union already invited the company back to the table for "good faith bargaining". It is the company that refuses to talk. I really feel sorry for Steven Ball, and Corey McPhee. They have to terrible job of spinning the garbage that comes from the foreign bean counters (vale). Corey, and Steve the company is taking you guys for a ride and making you like look like big time idiots in the process. I hope they are compensating you well for your efforts. No wonder the big shareholders are jumping over one another to sell their shares in vale. The company has no leadership.
Lloyd 12/11/2009 9:44:22 AM - Report Abuse

Of course it's misleading - just about everything that unions or the NDP say is misleading, and intentionally so.
They are the only ones who don't see that.
sean10 12/10/2009 9:45:43 PM - Report Abuse

USW 6500,
why not you guys focusing on the contract ? running around the globe is not touching anything, just a show to your workers that you are doing something for them, in fact you are the one that causing the problems. Can you return their union dues ?

also sending a NDP MPP to meet Brazilian PRESIDENT ? he is not even in there, he is in Europe, Man, what a big big Union show ? Do not fool the people that pay you dues..........
person_1 12/10/2009 6:20:49 PM - Report Abuse

I agree with you drifter. Let's wait and see.
drifter 12/10/2009 6:19:35 PM - Report Abuse

Well I trust the Boys from Pittsburgh and France will not have forgotten their cameras........I'm looking forward to seeing the Sudbury Committee meeting with the Brazilian Senate......that would be a momentous pic and an obvious one to take don't you think?
I'm not interested in the little one on one tete a tete pics......I want to see them with those high ranking officials like Neumann said.
person_1 12/10/2009 6:09:20 PM - Report Abuse

Hey Drifter,
***jingle*** "Do you hear what I hear?...Coming from the fields afar"

Bahhhh!!! Bahhhh!!! Bahhh!!!

Sheep! The lot of you!
beefy 12/10/2009 6:06:26 PM - Report Abuse

Same old complainers, same old drivel from the anti-union boys. You really don't want to see these guys gain any ground, do you? Jealousy???? Envy???? I just wonder what you guys are like in real life, must be a real barrel 'o fun, huh?
drifter 12/10/2009 6:02:02 PM - Report Abuse

What could Neumann expect from what the Boys from Pittsburgh describe as a 3rd World country? (Obviously they're not concerned about the effect this statement would have on a Senator from one of the worlds emerging BRIC powerhouse countries.)

Neumann...is that spelled the same as the guy in Seinfeld?
person_1 12/10/2009 5:56:22 PM - Report Abuse

Once again, the union's interpetation of how things are! Just like their interpetation of the contract! It was the union that stated Vale was to show up. Not the "Senator" of that country! It was Nuemann's statement "Vale officials were not compelled by Brazilian law to show up at the hearings" It was Nuemann once again making a statement that Vale persuaded the change in venue (regarding the meeting). Nowhere does this story indicate that there is any validation to that statement from Neumann. You people take the words of these union leaders and believe everything that comes out of their mouths with no form of proof or validation. Do you people know the meaning of "blind sheep"?
drifter 12/10/2009 5:45:25 PM - Report Abuse

Pitiful.
Is this the best the Boys from Pittsburgh can come up with?

It is better than saying......well we were chatting with this one guy who's a senator and while we were talking to him the phone rang and he answered it and told us," whatever we wanted to hear".

grasping at teeny tiny straws now. Why doesn't Leo just come to Sudbury, tell Steve he's willing to sacrifice his principles just to get the Sudbury guys back to work and I'll see you in 3 years.

Jan 16th could be a very black day for the union movement in Sudbury.
Kev N_1 12/10/2009 5:06:40 PM - Report Abuse

NOTICE the term "misleading" was used rather than "false" or "not true".

"Were not compelled by Brazilian law"? Does that mean they were required by law to show up and just didn't feel compelled to show?
catmac 12/10/2009 4:55:14 PM - Report Abuse

Brazilian Senator Paulo Paim, who set up the hearing, was persuaded by Vale to change it from a public hearing to a private hearing, said Neumann said, during the teleconference.
---
Why would Vale ask the meeting be changed from public to private, and then not show up? Then turn around and call during the meeting to see if the meeting is continuing without them? if they had no intention of going. They sound sneaky. I'm off the fence.
catmac 12/10/2009 4:52:16 PM - Report Abuse

Brazilian Senator Paulo Paim, who set up the hearing, was persuaded by Vale to change it from a public hearing to a private hearing, said Neumann said, during the teleconference.
---
Why would Vale ask the meeting be changed from public to private, and then not show up? Then turn around and call during the meeting to see if the meeting is continuing without them? if they had no intention of going. They sound sneaky. I'm off the fence.
RobertHood 12/10/2009 4:24:19 PM - Report Abuse

HUH?
Ginger_1 12/10/2009 4:11:15 PM - Report Abuse

Steve Ball said Vale wasn't invited to this meeting. Northern Life has not yet confirmed the state of this matter with the Union.
I have to ask, what would be the point of this union meeting with a Brazilian senator? It sounds way off target to me. Just like the rest of this strike.
rightofcentre 12/10/2009 3:50:48 PM - Report Abuse

whats the point of Vale showing up if the onions are still spewing their "we will go back to the table if Vale say there won't be concessions" line.

This union leadership is so boneheaded and out of touch its unreal.

Both parties are as bad as each other. Gerard and Agnelli should just get their weeners out on the table and measure who has the biggest one and be done with it - these games are getting childish and with no end in sight.
TITO_1 12/10/2009 3:13:40 PM - Report Abuse

SHAME SHAME SHAME VALE!!!
More bad faith B.S.
D. Laframboise 12/10/2009 2:48:23 PM - Report Abuse

What a bunch of cowards. They claim they need consessions to be sustainable in all business cycles, but they won't bother showing up to a hearing to discuss the changes needed? This company is pathetic and they are run by a bunch of low life cowards. Where is the canadian government in all of this?

Steelworkers give 'misleading story' about Brazilian meeting, says Vale

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